Nitrous and E85

[philzoot007]

i still carry my spare. just on top of the carpet now lol.

some have mounted the bottle behind the drivers seat. i dont like the safety of that so i hid mine in the trunk.

[GMRedline]

When your baby screams and whines give it the bottle...Nitrous Trifecta GMS3

You shouldn't need a fuel system upgrade. What you have will be enough.

I have not even ran a full 10# bottle through my car so I am certainly not an expert on the topic but when it comes to E85 and Nitrous I am as close as they get.

From what I have researched the general consensus is you could run a 50 shot on almost any setup all day long and not worry about a thing. 75 shot is the most people recommend. With a 100 shot you are asking for trouble. There are only a couple of guys who ran a 100 shot for a while. Both that I know of eventually had engine failure.

With your setup I would recommend starting with a 50 shot and then possibly working your way up. Don't get too crazy to start.

With E85 your going to need to size your fuel jet ~30% larger then the nitrous jet.

[GMRedline]

Here is another good nitrous thread.

CBodnar's Build Thread

[slitterell]

Talked to nitrous express. Apparently, for direct port on our cars, and you need a rising rate fuel pressure regulator to compensate for boost in the im.

Also found out they are 2hrs away.

I am just trying to get my facts straight. I have heard of lsj's making 400 hp on the stock block. The sc is very hard pull on the motor with that much power. How would nitrous as opposed to all sc be more of a strain?

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[GMRedline]

You don't need to raise your FP for a direct port setup. You just need to size your jets according to the net FP you will be running while spraying. Our fuel system is setup to run ~58psi. If you are running 15# of boost from the SC your net FP will be ~43psi at the nitrous injection port. So when you size your jets you need to use 43psi instead of 58psi for your estimates. Not a big deal really.

Stock LSJs can handle 400whp with a super efficient turbo and a good tune. If you want to spray a stock LSJ to 400hp you will run into long term reliability issues. Could you do it a few times? Probably. Could you do it 50 times? idk...

The difference between making 400whp on a turbo and 400whp on a blower is the strain the blower puts on the engine. To make 400hp to the wheels with a turbo the engine actually has to make ~440hp at the flywheel. The general rule of thumb is 15% drivetrain loss. To make 400hp to the wheels with a blower the engine has to make ~470hp at the flywheel depending on the efficiency of the blower. With a blower you have to factor in drive train loss and lose of spinning the blower. Its been estimated that the M62 can require ~20hp to spin with a stock pulley. The smaller you go, the more hp required.

I guess I would have to ask what the point of 400hp anyway. Phil mentioned a progressive controller and you would need one for sure or your tires won't be able to get any traction with a 100 or 125 shot.

Get a good tune for your 2.7" and add a 50-75 shot. That will put you between 350-375whp with your PNP head and cams. That will be more then enough to pull on most LSJ TVS cars even if they are running E85.

[slitterell]

Well, 470hp minus the supercharger strain. I understand, and though.

My thoughts were a 50 in 2nd and a 100 shot for 3rd.

I am already having traction issues I have 2nd, though. I am getting my rotors and hubs re drilled for 5x114.3 I want to run a 8 inch wheel. Then, for track, I will have drag radials. Traction won't be an issue
I might just want for my motor build then. 100 shot plus small pulley tv's

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[philzoot007]

a 50 shot in second on our cars is an issue with any tire u have on the car. if thats ur plan u deff need the controller. second goes by very fast. i spray 3 and 4 if i want to go that deep. u can really dial in a good progressive controller according to ur traction. just takes some test and tune at the track.

[slitterell]

Also, you are injecting into the tb spacer, right?
According to NE, I would have to use a rrfpr to keep the manifold pressure and fuel pressure rising at a 1 to 1 rate as I would be doing direct port. Otherwise, nothing compensates causing the resistance of fuel in the ports to increase resulting in less fuel.

I am considering letting them install it. I figure the makers of the product would know what they doing i am putting this on the back burner for now as I find out whether I am getting laid off or not. I may have a new job lined up, though.

[hnbracing]

you don't need rrfpr or a brfps to run spray on these cars plenty of people have 125 to 150 shot on complete stock engine with cams I would think higher hp on a less shot but good info gm but why fuel for 43 psi of the fuel when its 58

[slitterell]

I haven't seen direct port, as I mentioned I am doing. Has anyone done it that you have seen?

Spraying it in the tb spacer is one thing . There is no increased resistance from the built pressure. The few people I have talked to that are boosted and on the bottle say the same thing as nitrous express and that is for the fuel solenoid on the nitrous setup, it requires a rrfpr, not our fuel system.

Here is how it was explained to me. If you have 58 psi fuel rail at 0 psi air intake, you effectively have 58 psi fuel flowing into the runners. If you increase boost to 16 psi, your effective fuel psi is 42. This means at the top end you will be going lean. You can't tune that injector to produce more fuel without changing pills or using g a rrfpr. What it does you do is through I will a large pill and set the regulator lower. So say 42 psi fuel at 0 psi air. By the time you are 16 psi air, the regulator is at 58 psi, making the effective fuel psi 42. Make sense or am I blabbering again?