[ZR2_S10]

Stock SC pulley?

Anyone scan their car for KR w/ the stock pulley on? If so what were you seeing?

How much boost do you see stock?

Anyone got a good pic of the engine bay?


thanks!


Jason

 

[Sp00ner]

KR? Elaborate for me, I'm simple.



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[MotorMouth]

KR? Elaborate for me, I'm simple.

Knock Retard

The ammount of timming that the computer pulls based on what the knock sensor is detecting. Usually measured in degree.

 

[Sp00ner]

I saw some pully swaps on this Cobalt site that I found earlier. I'm under the impression that we are running pretty close to maximum speed for the unit at redline though. There actually was a few parts at this Cobalt site, but most had release dates rather than current availibility.



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[ZR2_S10]

I find it hard to believe that GM would run the blower at or near max speed. The grand prix gtp's come stock w/ a 3.8" pulley, and guys run down to a 2.6" pulley with gains.

How big is the stock pulley?

 

[goofyguy]

3.5 inches is the stock pulley, and the pics are below

 

[ZR2_S10]

Thanks goofyguy.


That pulley is HUGE! good lord.

Has anyone tried a smaller pulley? Say a 3.4 or a 3.25"?

There are ALOT of pulley options for the M90,and reading the cobaltss forum, it seems that the M62 uses the same pulley.

That blower looks alot like the Gen V M90 (the most efficent M90 yet).

Whats the electrical connector in the top of the blower on the right?

Also, it seems that the Redline's use a single belt system? Is that right?

Im tryin to get some info for a friend that just got an ion redline. She wants to boost up the performance some.

Jason

 

[ALL4GLH]

A guy at work that owns a honda is determined that adding retarded looking stickers adds HP. Maybe try that?

 

[ZR2_S10]

[ sarcasm ]

Sweet DOoooOD!

Is it true then that every 1 square inch of vinyl applied to the factory paint adds .5 hp to the wheels?

[ /sarcasm]


Just so ya'll dont think Im some kind of Noob w/ this stuff, here is the car I work on around here. We are shooting for low 12's in this 3400lb boat this year.

Grand Prix GTP

If yall want to learn about blown GM engines, www.clubgp.com and www.3800tech.com are good places to start.

Jason

 

[goofyguy]

Yes the M90 will attach to the m62 super charger. The connector is a map sensor. 1 of 3 or 4. Im waiting for a fuel option and to see what the computer will do once more boost is added by Pis Fi. Your not on the S10forum.com are you?

http://www.automotive.eaton.com/product/engine_controls/superchargers/M62.asp

hell they dont even have a line for more than 10psi. Thats what you get a small motor a big supercharger a ton of power but it also take 30 to spin that SOB to 6500 rpms.

 

[ZR2_S10]

I am... havent been there in quite a while though.

Holy cow, 3 or more Map sensors?

what size injectors did GM go w/ on that motor?

Is the Fuel Pressure Regulator Boost Referenced?

Jason

 

[Sp00ner]

I find it hard to believe that GM would run the blower at or near max speed. The grand prix gtp's come stock w/ a 3.8" pulley, and guys run down to a 2.6" pulley with gains.

How big is the stock pulley?

Not sure, but the Eaton website has the critical info on the blower available. Max RPM's, etc. Someone on here did the math and figured that at redline, the blower was running real close to max speed. What RPM does a GP run up to? We're hitting 6,450 as the max, I'm under the impression that the GP is a little lower than that, and with the RPMs of the charger increasing more than the engine I think it gets pretty close. Let us know what ya think, always can use more opinions. When I saw the pulleys at the Cobalt site though it got me thinking that maybe it can run a little faster.



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[goofyguy]

Spooners right the supercharger is running near capacity now. A smaller pulley will yeild full boost at lower RPMs but that is about it. A electronic controler will let us get more PSI but not much. According to the numbers I came up with the most this will let us have is around 16-18 give or take. We need a bigger supercharger for more than that. And I think the computer adds the fuel not a bosot referenced regualtor.

 

[ZR2_S10]

The PCM has an Injector Flow Table that is vacuum referenced (0 kPa to 100kPa). At least on the GP, the manual regulator takes over once in boost (it increases fuel pressure 1psi for every pound of boost).

As far as the pulley speed of the supercharger, I just looked at THIS site, and it shows the M90 maxxing out at 12000 rpm, I know for fact that we are spinning it at close to 14k now, and once we get the intercooler on, will spin it up to 17k.

Perhaps one of you could talk to Zooomer (owner) of ZZperformance.com and he could do some testing for you.

He's located in Grand Rapids, MI, and he and his crew have developed a supercharger tester.

He could find out at what speed its maxxed out.

As far as the 'too much heat' thing I keep reading about on here. It seems that one member says the outlet temp of the 62 is 185 deg.

Unless it has something to do w/ the alum heads / block, thats an awful low number.

Here is a LINK to some testing they did with different intercoolers.

Dont mind the bickering, it gets quite childish over there a bit.

Here is the pic you cant see.

Notice they spun those up to 14k, to simulate 13lbs of boost (gp's only have 8 stock!)

Jason

 

[goofyguy]

now I know. Anyone wanna try out the thrasher modular kit? i may jump on it unless I can find a buyer for the car anytime soon.

 

[Sp00ner]

What do you guys have for an intercooler now? Or is there none? I was thinking that working the intercoolers or something along that effect had some power gain potential.



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[goofyguy]

there is a liquid to air intercooler between the supercharger and the manifold. It has a pump that pushes coolant through it and its intercooler unit is mounted between the ac condensor and the radiator. That why I feel the heat issue isnt a problem for the supercharger. Even though some poeple look at Eaton website and think thats a lot of heat those test are all without a intercooler. zr2_s10 linked a site that shows comparision of differnt intercoolers as well.

 

[ZR2_S10]

The Grand Prix's, Regal GS's and such w/ the M90s didnt even come with a intercooler!

Blower sits right on top of the alum intake manifold, which bolted to the cast iron heads / block.


Perhaps they (GM) decided to intercool the 2.0's was because of the alum head / block?

An aftermarket intercooler on the grand prix, combined with a smaller pulley, is usually good for around 30ish wheel hp.

Jason

 

[Sp00ner]

But couldn't we drop the temps of everything in front of the supercharger, and the intercooler to get some HP? What is the temp coming out of the charger? I think the site said around 180-190? Is that correct, or is that manufacturer's numbers? What does our intercooler drop the temp to? The more I learn about these forced induction engines, the more I read about dropping the air temp of the intake to as low as possible. Some statements even suggest running the car a little richer than a N/A motor so that the evaporating fuel can cool the intake charge. I've even been reading about people that run cent. superchargers and turbos through a metal box in the passenger's sides of the car that is full of dry ice, and then still spray liquid C02 or nitrous oxide on the intercooler cores. I know that these are race cars for the most part, but this idea has to be worth looking into. (No I'm not suggesting a cooler riding shotgun) If the supercharger is near max speed, then the only way to increase the effective density is to cool the air charge even more. Spinning the charger faster might just result in more of a negative effect from the heat than the extra volume generated. A 10% drop in intake manifold air charge temps is worth alot of horsepower. Just a thought... but I have been looking at different cooling options for the engine, not talking about the radiator here, and there is alot of options. I know that I've mentioned this before, and people thought that looking at the supercharger was an end game, but I'm not talking about the charger itself, just the temp of the gas in the manifold.



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[navymitch12]

i dont know how this would work with a liquid intercooler but i know NOS makes a intercooler spray bar that is used to cool the air down in and air/air intercooler would it work with our intercoolers if we put it on the coolant radiator and cool down the water more.

i could be wrong but i think it might do something but not sure