I usually recommend chains at 125k-150k. But do to age, and not know how previous owner drove it, it's possible. Could pop the valve cover off and see if the chain is stretched. Could be the tensioner
Timing chain?
So in the past week I started to hear a pretty noisy rattle that sounds like it's from the front of the engine, and gets louder when the engine is revving up or down, but gets quieter when holding speed.
I'm 95% sure it's the chain but wanted others input to be safe. Since having the epiphany that the sound is likely the chain I've stopped driving it, so I only drove it with the noise for a couple days.
Does this sound right for 89k miles? The last 13k miles of which is with an increased redline to 7.2k rpm and me driving the piss out of the car the entire time I've had it since 69k miles. Of course, with 3k oil changes.
I'm 95% sure it's the chain but wanted others input to be safe. Since having the epiphany that the sound is likely the chain I've stopped driving it, so I only drove it with the noise for a couple days.
Does this sound right for 89k miles? The last 13k miles of which is with an increased redline to 7.2k rpm and me driving the piss out of the car the entire time I've had it since 69k miles. Of course, with 3k oil changes.
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You're probably right with this actually, the rattle sound happened suddenly rather than over time. Though, I already have a timing kit that was meant for another car so I'll just do an entire timing service, complete with the zzp upgraded chain guide and upgraded guide bolts to better handle my higher redline. Oh, and the cloyes kit I have has the upgraded chain oil nozzle as well.Could be the tensioner
Definitely the smarter option to just do it all. It's no secret our timing design is trash. Plus some good reassurance for the next 100kYou're probably right with this actually, the rattle sound happened suddenly rather than over time. Though, I already have a timing kit that was meant for another car so I'll just do an entire timing service, complete with the zzp upgraded chain guide and upgraded guide bolts to better handle my higher redline. Oh, and the cloyes kit I have has the upgraded chain oil nozzle as well.
It's probably not so much trash as it is just not up to par for a performance engine. Our 196k mile '03 ion 2 still has all of the original timing components (and clutch). Though that's a bit of a risk to drive it so much without a timing service lolDefinitely the smarter option to just do it all. It's no secret our timing design is trash. Plus some good reassurance for the next 100k
I bet the bolt broke on the guide. I can’t tell you how many ecotec’s I’ve done with a broken guide bolt.
That and a failed tensioner are the two main reasons the chain can rattle is what I've heard. I'm hoping it's the tensioner, I don't want to have to deal with a broken bolt...I bet the bolt broke on the guide. I can’t tell you how many ecotec’s I’ve done with a broken guide bolt.
While we're on this subject, have you even once had an easy time removing the broken bolt from the head? Is it possible to just leave the broken piece of bolt in the head since the updated design doesn't use those threads?
I don’t have any experience using the updated design. My professional opinion is id remove the broken bolt. They come out fairly easy anyway. I wouldn’t trust leaving it in there. It may work it’s way loose.
That's exactly what I wanted to hear!They come out fairly easy anyway.
So, yesterday I spent about 8 hours with a couple small breaks replacing both chains, all guides, both tensioners, timing cover gasket (why is it designed in such a way that the engine mount has to be removed, like wtf, so I just cut out the upper brace part of the gasket that the motor mount attaches through, problem solved), valve cover gasket, both cam bolts, the crank bolt, and the front main seal. All in all it wasn't too difficult, but I did have to loosen the engine mount (not completely remove, though it's worth noting I have the ZZP poly engine mount) in order to get the larger idler pulley bolt out through the access hole.
Also, it seems my rattle came from the balance shaft chain tensioner being loose. Really strange. Everything else seemed perfectly intact. I guess add that to the list of failure points lol
parts used:
Cloyes ecotec timing kit including the upgraded timing chain oiling port, I kept all the stock gears
ZZP ecotec upgraded timing chain guide
Upgraded upper guide bolt
Updated timing chain tensioner
OEM Crank bolt
OEM Cam bolts
OEM Timing cover and valve cover gaskets
Chain noise is gone, thank God. Car was only down for two weeks but it felt like a month 😓
Also, it seems my rattle came from the balance shaft chain tensioner being loose. Really strange. Everything else seemed perfectly intact. I guess add that to the list of failure points lol
parts used:
Cloyes ecotec timing kit including the upgraded timing chain oiling port, I kept all the stock gears
ZZP ecotec upgraded timing chain guide
Upgraded upper guide bolt
Updated timing chain tensioner
OEM Crank bolt
OEM Cam bolts
OEM Timing cover and valve cover gaskets
Chain noise is gone, thank God. Car was only down for two weeks but it felt like a month 😓
I can’t tell you how many ecotec’s I’ve done with a broken guide bolt.
I did mine last year with 160k and the original chain, had the same broken guide bolt. It reduced the engine noise a quite bit but I've now found some of the noise is originating from the supercharger too. I had mine ported by Category V last year and the needle bearings replaced but I think I still have noise in the gear housing, so I think I'm sending that next for a rebuild.
That ZZP timing chain guide wasn't around last year, still salty about that
That ZZP timing chain guide wasn't around last year, still salty about that
I changed my original timing chain components at 250k, who knows how long that bolt was broken for 🤣 , i would not advise others to wait as long lol
Agreed considering the age of these motors if the timing chain hasn't been done yet do it now. That guide bolt is probably broken.i would not advise others to wait as long lol
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