[nbuddle1974]

from the first month I owned my 04 RL it has had a problem starting and when it does it dies if I try to rev it above 1000 rpms. When it finally starts, one to two minutes later, it blows out black and white smoke. I have 17,000 miles on it now, but this only happens on long trips, a day of hard city driving(red lining the engine) and very cold mornings when I'm back home in Indiana. this is becoming annoying. Saturn has ajusted the cam twice and replaced the cat converter once. Now I have an appointment Thursday for the same thing, and they are beginning to just stratch their heads and say "I don't know whats wrong with it." I love my RL and just want the problem fixed. You guys are my last hope and if you guys can't help I guess I'm screwed.

P.S. the Saturn techs in Indiana and Florida now know me by my first name.

 

[SaturnI0Nredline]

You might as well wait

I'm having the same problem. Even shut off completly when down shifting. They are starting to replace the starter switch. but there is a new ecu upgrade coming out for engines running rich at start up and while running. It is suppose to come out this month. As of monday it has not been released yet. You might wait to ask about the start switch and see if that help. I have had 3 cam sensor 1 Maf sensor and 1 Converter and still have a problem just not that often as it was before. Like you I hope this new ecu program fixes it.

 

[Sp00ner]

Black and white smoke?? Wow... I had the cam sensor problem, and the ECU was updated about a week ago, but it never did that. How hard do you drive the thing, too hard? Well, white smoke is running rich, right? Or it's coolant leaking through into the system. Is it black smoke or blue smoke thats coming out with it? My problem was a difficult start up, and when I'd run to redline the car would stall, then have a hard time starting cause the timing was basically out of whack from the cam sensor. Never had any smoke that was noticeable from the car, could you have popped a head gasket?



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[JPK]

I suggest you just let the dealer do its thing with the warranty work. Also, look up the lemon laws in your state just in case it comes down to that.

I don't think that driving it too hard should cause any of that. These cars were made to be driven hard. Hell, my car hates going slow and she begs me to give her the WOT all the time.

And I give it to her alright.

 

[Sp00ner]

I know, they're meant to be driven hard, just looking at some options for him, sounds like 2 cars I've had with bad head gaskets.



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[nbuddle1974]

I dont drive the hell out of it and sorry it is white and blue smoke not black. It has shut off as well at red line a few times. Every time it has came out of the shop it has improved but not like I would like. I also have inquired about the lemon law but will use that as a last resort.

 

[JPK]

I dont drive the hell out of it and sorry it is white and blue smoke not black. It has shut off as well at red line a few times. Every time it has came out of the shop it has improved but not like I would like. I also have inquired about the lemon law but will use that as a last resort.

Yes, the rev limiter will kick in once you hit the redline. That's normal and is programmed into the computer. It's always gonna do that until we find a way to bypass that or bump up the limiter some.

 

[nbuddle1974]

Yes, the rev limiter will kick in once you hit the redline. That's normal and is programmed into the computer. It's always gonna do that until we find a way to bypass that or bump up the limiter some.

no no the engine completely shut off and I had to pop the clutch.

 

[Sp00ner]

That is what mine did once, the second time popping the clutch didn't start it, took about 5 min of sitting and just started right up. Didnt get smoke as I said before. Do you know what they did to the cam, was it the position sensor? Dunno man, I had it in once, they replaced the Cam Postition Sensor and reflashed the ECU and it's been great for 2 weeks now. I know some people are having recurring problems with what seems to be the CPS, but it keeps occuring. There is a statement in the TSB for the senor replacement that states how important it is that the sensor not be turned even the smallest amount when being replaced, maybe people are getting careless techs in some situations?



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[nbuddle1974]

That is what mine did once, the second time popping the clutch didn't start it, took about 5 min of sitting and just started right up. Didnt get smoke as I said before. Do you know what they did to the cam, was it the position sensor? Dunno man, I had it in once, they replaced the Cam Postition Sensor and reflashed the ECU and it's been great for 2 weeks now. I know some people are having recurring problems with what seems to be the CPS, but it keeps occuring. There is a statement in the TSB for the senor replacement that states how important it is that the sensor not be turned even the smallest amount when being replaced, maybe people are getting careless techs in some situations?

I dont know exactly, unfortionatly not the best when it comes to understanding engine lingo, but he said something about he put in the specs from a disc 11, 12 and I will need to come back to get the updated version 13 when he called me. now that was in Indiana, now that i'm back in Florida they are telling me about an ECU upgraded program that will make my something or other stop making the gas to rich or flooding the engine. Sorry but I will know more Thursday.

 

[Sp00ner]

If they have not replaced or woked on the cam position sensor, explain to them that you understand there is some issues with other owners with that specific part, and that their symptoms have been very similar. Just ask them if they can look for the service bulletin on it and see if that is something that would make sense to them. My dealership needed a little prodding, but did get to it pretty quickly once they found the bulletin on it.



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[nbuddle1974]

Hell I had Saturn tow my vehicle when it would not fire for two days and they kept it for two weeks, giving me a rental of course, told me that they put it in their garage, during an Indiana cold ass late December, and after attempting to start it for 5 min it ran good and started right up everytime after that. Needless to say that a week later I returned it and said try again. Thats when he explained to me about the cam sensor and a leak in my catylic coverter that could be sucking in cold air but when the engine was warm the metal expanded it was clogging the hole and running better. uh-ok.

 

[nbuddle1974]

If they have not replaced or woked on the cam position sensor, explain to them that you understand there is some issues with other owners with that specific part, and that their symptoms have been very similar. Just ask them if they can look for the service bulletin on it and see if that is something that would make sense to them. My dealership needed a little prodding, but did get to it pretty quickly once they found the bulletin on it.

yes he showed me the paper from Saturn engineers that stated that many of the ion RL where experiencing these same problems but where do you live SpOOner cause I'll just take to your dealership since IN, FL and GA(not all throughout these states) have not got the answer yet.

 

[Vita]

i've had mine running rich, comes on cruising on the freeway about 70, it's also completely died on me twice now, all dash lights going off, but the needles stay red!?!

it's in the shop now since last thursday, and they still weren't done on yesterday, hopefully they'll call me today and let me know what's up.

i've also got them fixing the rotors since they're getting deep gouges, and the rear bumper scratching, not to mention the cold start issue, which for me is sparradic (SP?)

 

[LoungeLizard]

The white smoke would be from another cat problem.

 

[Sp00ner]

yes he showed me the paper from Saturn engineers that stated that many of the ion RL where experiencing these same problems but where do you live SpOOner cause I'll just take to your dealership since IN, FL and GA(not all throughout these states) have not got the answer yet.

Chicago, the dealer is in the NW burbs, called Saturn of Lake Barrington



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[nbuddle1974]

I just got off the phone with my saturn tech and he said the 05 program disc to "fix" my problem just came in. I asked him if I could get it done at any saturn dealer and he said as long as they have the disc. So tomorrow I'm going to take my baby in and she was this does and post it later that night or next day.